What is the best 2 bay wash layout ?

[Scrub Free]

I currently have 2 laser wash 4000. I'm close to 're powering. I think my best layout is investing in a soft touch in one bay ( Pdq tandem of Ryko soft gloss max )and keep one laser wash 4000 in operation using the other for parts. The other option I have considered is stretching the budget and doing 2 laser wash 360 plus.
Any opinions?

 

[PEI]

If you are considering putting in a friction unit, why not put in a mini-tunnel. The cost should be less than 2 Laserwash 360+'s. They can generally do about 36 cars an hour in a 35 foot bay.

 

[Scrub Free]

I have not considered a mini tunnel so have done no research would I need someone on site?

 

[rph9168]

Big difference between managing a short tunnel and automatics. Automatics can be open 24/7 and they are not attended all the time they are open. Short tunnels require to have someone on site whenever it is open. Lot size, shape and layout are very important and different for either set up. There are many other considerations but these are the most basic when considering either option.

 

[Scrub Free]

I like the idea of a tunnel output but I prefer my flexibility with the iba
I know I get best results with an attendant even with the touch free
Do you think a soft touch system would require an attendant any more than a touch free system?

 

[robert roman]

‘I currently have 2 laser….4000….close to 're powering…opinions?”

Carwash operators often use benefit cost analysis to support decision making when it’s time to re-load the wash bay (investment).

Benefit is total sales potential minus current sales.

Once the potential benefit is known, cost (investment) can be matched to ensure an adequate return.

“….investing in a soft touch in one bay….keep one laser….other for parts… stretching the budget….2 l360 plus.”

So, I don’t see how anyone could recommend anything because you provided no benefits or costs.

 

[Scrub Free]

This was not a financial question, maybe I should 're phrase my original post. The only thing I know about friction machines is what salespeople have told me. I have had multiple salespeople tell me that having one friction and one touch free would be best. My intention of the post is to gather real information. Robert Roman, do you have a similar set up and if so do you think having one friction and one touch free is best ? Do you think the friction machine can do a top wash in 5 minutes or will I slow down production tremendously?

 

[robert roman]

“I have had multiple salespeople tell me that having one friction and one touch free would be best.”

20 questions, what do you mean by best?

Finish quality, throughput, maintenance, capital cost, chemical, water, electric usage, up-time, attraction rate, blah, blah, sales talk.

Any friction, touchless or hybrid in-bay can be made to do want you want it to, they are programmable.

I’ve designed top-wash packages that can be done in three minutes and four.

Suppliers don’t care for this so much because they sell less chemical to operator but operator makes lots more money.

That’s pretty real.

Some of my clients with dual friction in-bays have NOI of over $200K.

That’s pretty financial.

 

[Scrub Free]

Thank you, that's good information. Do you think the friction machine will cost me a considerable amount of time with maintenance or monitoring? I feel like it would be equal since my laser washes are "antique" reliable but still old .

 

[Waxman]

what about doing a facelift instead? maybe speed the machines up a bit, new nozzles, new decals, freshen the bays and add some new lights??? maybe a nice canopy over the pay stations. some windows in the bays if you dont already have them. you could add something you don't have like a lava arch with l.e.d.'s that correspond to lava flow.

i stay away from friction because i don't want the hassle of added damage claims. there is a new friction competitor in my market and i have already had my customers tell me they know of cars it scratched. i just do not want that headache in my life. it's enough to deal with the occasional impact of a touchfree on a vehicle ( under a malfunction), but most times i can explain how nothing but soap and water touches your car, so these perpendicular black rubber marks on your hood are probably from a worn out snow broom.

 

[robert roman]

“Do you think the friction machine will cost me a considerable amount of time with maintenance or monitoring?”

Vehicle damage will be negligible (not material difference in profits). There will be less maintenance cost. Necessary operating expenses will be lower.

Monitoring operations is relative.

For example, “i stay away from friction because i don't want the hassle of added damage claims.”

On other hand, most owners I know chose in-bay (friction or touchless) primarily so they or employee wouldn’t have to be there all day to operate the business.

“i have already had my customers tell me they know of cars it scratched.”

Since most people have no clue of how their car actually works or what it’s painted with, how could they possibly discern from second-hand information that alleged damage was caused by new friction roll-over.

Vehicle damage occurs at every wash just as something will eventually break on every machine.

More than 75 percent of the total market is now washed by automated friction machines.

That kinda speaks for itself.

 

[soonermajic]

If you already have had multiple customers telling you they know of customers who's cars were scratched.....what difference does it make if it really did or not? They believe it to be true, & it is probably their reality. Hence, there may in fact be more customers inclined to stay away, just from the stories they've heard.

 

[Waxman]

75% of what market is washed by friction; in bay rollovers or all car washes? i am guessing it's all car washes because tunnels can handle far more cph / cpd than in bay automatics.

but it is a whole different business, with different hours of operation and employee needs and equipment maintenance schedules, safety protocols, etc.

 

[Greg Pack]

I have always operated touch free until I bought a combo machine about four years ago. It has slowly but surely gained in popularity. The damage claims of a properly operating machine are negligible. But I do find pieces of trim the bay on occasion. So I guess I'm in support of the 1 friction/1 touchless idea.

If your wash is fairly high volume, or on a great potential site and you're attending the business now more than 30 hours a week anyway I would consider a tunnel.

 

[Scrub Free]

Fortunately I don't spend even close to 30 hours there. I understand that a certain amount of damage claims may be inevitable. This I'm sure will vary depending on training customers and good equipment maintenance. 1 will the friction machine take twice the amount of time as the touch free for maintenance?
2 I'm sick of the bad wash calls when temperature changes seems to take a day or two for the wash quality to stabilize. cfcw Would a friction machine have a more consistent wash quality?
3 i am assuming that I Will get a new customer base ( more customers) since it will be a different market. Is this true?

 

[Scrub Free]

Wax man, good ideas but my laser wash is so old I don't think I can even install triple foam. And realistically the machines have limited time left mostly due to our environment they suffer from heavy corrosion. So I feel confident in moving forward with new equipment then I can maintain them fresh myself in hopes to get many years. Damage claims may be my biggest concern.... Besides the possibility it will cost me more time.

 

[rph9168]

With the new friction machines there are very few damage claims and much more consistent cleaning than a touchless wash. As far as timing goes as someone has already mentioned it depends how you program the machine but there is no reason to believe one should take more time than the other. Like any other car wash equipment the key is preventative maintenance which should not be much if any more if any with a friction machine. Chemical and water usage costs will be higher in the touchless machine which could offset any additional maintenance with the friction machine if there is any.

It would be interesting to hear from operators that have one of each. From my experience you will probably get more friction than touchless washes. I have seen that in most of the sites I have visited when they have both types of washes. When we argue which type is better than the other we often forget that customers are there to get a clean car as many assume that is what they will get when they use a wash. Maybe in the past some shied away from friction but it is not nearly as much of a concern as getting a clean car with today's car wash customers.

 

[washnshine]

Maybe in the past some shied away from friction but it is not nearly as much of a concern as getting a clean car with today's car wash customers.

I agree. When the touch free washes gained so much popularity in the '90's, there were no closed cell foam materials, and most friction machines did not have much in terms of wash solution chemistry, high pressure functions, thorough wheel cleaning, extra services, etc. The touch free washes were an alternative for mediocre in-bay friction machines.

There were also not the options back then to drive top package prices as high as we can now. Extra services like RainX, Hot Wax, Lava, Tire Shine, etc. So if a customer comes into a wash today, and lays out $12 or higher, there won't be much room for forgiveness if the quality is not top-notch.

 

[DiamondWash]

I stay away from friction because i don't want the hassle of added damage claims. there is a new friction competitor in my market and i have already had my customers tell me they know of cars it scratched. i just do not want that headache in my life. it's enough to deal with the occasional impact of a touchfree on a vehicle ( under a malfunction), but most times i can explain how nothing but soap and water touches your car, so these perpendicular black rubber marks on your hood are probably from a worn out snow broom.

In 15 years of operation I have not had 1 damage claim for scratching a vehicle in my SoftGloss, it all comes down maintaining your equipment properly and regularly I have had this conversation more then once with wash owners in my area which some are now either out of business or their numbers went way down because of there attitude on maintaining their equipment.