I've got an unusual situation with a customer that has one of these things. There is no three phase electric at the wash, so a Roto Phase generator is supplying that. The installers wired the phase generator to run 24/7. This seems odd. Their logic, if you can call it that, is the automatic needs the 3 phase all the time. I'm assuming because they use a transformer ran off it for the control power to the plc. There has to be a simple way to run the control power seperately. Any ideas? A friend who works on these said to be very careful because this particular plc costs $20,000. Think about that for a minute. Especially if you are thinking of buying one. I called the factory, but bless their heart, Mark 7 will not talk to you without a letter from the pope and a secret handshake.
Wesumat owners
- Thread starter mac
- Start date
MEP001
Well-known member
Assuming the system controller can run with single-phase, it seems like it could be isolated from the 3-phase power generated by the Roto-Phase. A very basic PLC could receive the signal that a wash has been armed and spin it up, and a delay put in place to stop it if the wash is idle for a predetermined time.
I've seen one of these units on a Kleindeinst, and it was set to come on two seconds before anything demanded power from it.
I've seen one of these units on a Kleindeinst, and it was set to come on two seconds before anything demanded power from it.
Greg Pack
Wash Weenie
I can figure out how to wire it to the Wesumat and control it with a timer. What I am not sure of is the functioning of the plc and how it's powered. I just don't want to see a small mushroom cloud emerge from a 20K plc in the process.
pitzerwm
Active member
The PLC wouldn't be 3PH anyway, the voltage and the correct grounding would be main concern. Check with the Roto people maybe. Isn't the PLC just a switching device? The power to it should be isolated, (sort of) from the motors etc.
MEP001
Well-known member
The add-on PLC could be powered from any source, including the isolated power to the Wesumat's PLC. If there's an output from the Wesumat's PLC that can trigger the add-on's to enable the Roto-Phase, you would just need to get a PLC that can use that voltage as an input, or just use a relay.
The Siemens Logo! units I use are nothing more than a very programmable relay with all sorts of time delay abilities, pulsing, etc. The Roto-Phase would need a contactor to control it, which would be controlled by the add-on PLC.
The Siemens Logo! units I use are nothing more than a very programmable relay with all sorts of time delay abilities, pulsing, etc. The Roto-Phase would need a contactor to control it, which would be controlled by the add-on PLC.
mr-gte, this particular site is not close to three phase. The power company has quoted about $75,000 to bring it there, and the Roto phase was about $8,000. Mark 7 has a tech support policy now of only providing it to their distributors. So if you happen to live by an incompetent distributor, you get no tech support.
RykoPro
Technician/Manager
To energize a phase generator only when the wash is armed is simple! I do not understand how a distributor who supposedly repairs so many different wash brands is unable to figure this out. A relay controlling the existing contactor will suffice. It is even simpler to find what is powering the PLC! Have you figured this out yet? If not, I can do it for you (for a small fee).
Mr rykopro, thank you for the informative reply. I don't claim to know everything about all machines out there. That is why I sometimes ask for other's experience when encountering something I haven't done, and especially when a mistake could cost someone that much frigging money for a plc. Yes, I know it is simple to do as you suggest. What I don't know are the particular ramifications to the plc. Maybe you can afford to play with a $20,000 piece of equipment, but I don't like to. Not only would someone be out a lot of money, but the owner might be down for a while. I simply take that into consideration.
Sabertooth Texas Car Wash
New member
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2007
- Messages
- 4
- Reaction score
- 0
- Points
- 1
Mac,
Mark VII has two controllers in the machines that come from Germany. They both run on 24VDC, not 3 phase. The old CPU is pretty expensive to replace. Around $9,000 (not $20,000), but the new style K100 that they have out is under $2,500. The new one (K100, I think) lets you do lots of stuff with the wash packages that the old one won't. Unless you power the PLC with voltage higher than 24VDC, they hold up pretty well.
Mark VII has two controllers in the machines that come from Germany. They both run on 24VDC, not 3 phase. The old CPU is pretty expensive to replace. Around $9,000 (not $20,000), but the new style K100 that they have out is under $2,500. The new one (K100, I think) lets you do lots of stuff with the wash packages that the old one won't. Unless you power the PLC with voltage higher than 24VDC, they hold up pretty well.
