Conveyor startup speed

[Rmax]

We have a 2 year old 95' tunnel with DRB controller and Belanger equipment. When we open in the morning, our conveyor is .34 fps and slowly gets up to .45 fps. Takes 2+ hours depending on how busy we are. Not a big deal except if the simulated pulse gets automatically activated at the slower speed and then is not noticed right away washes get off rather quickly until it is recognized and corrected. 2 questions. Is it normal for conveyors to start that slow? And does everyone deal with simulated pulse being needed on a daily basis? Thanks for any input

 

[Earl Weiss]

1. Sim Pulse should not be activated on a regular basis. If you are losing pulses that frequently you need to find and correct the problem. 2. Do you have remote pulse or a sensor on the sprocket? Remote can vary as the drive /motor and pulse motor can by pass oil at different speeds and the variation can increase as it heats up. 3. Are the measurements you provide off what you measure or the DRB readout? If off thereadout you should measure yourself. to see if it is accurate. FWIW using a Standard 20 feet per car 1 foot / sec = 180 CPH . That mean at .34 you are at 60 CPH which seems really slow.

 

[MC3033]

Is this hydraulic or electric?

I had an older AVW conveyor pack that did this to a lesser extent. For the first hour or so the conveyor would crawl.

 

[Rmax]

Thanks for the input.

I have a hydraulic conveyor. Just put fresh ISO32 in it and it is just 2 years old. Always been something the employees have had to stay on top of.

Earl, to answer your points. We have a pulse sensor on the drive sprocket watching the 4 bolts. Just replaced it and cleaned the bolts. That helped but it's odd some days it just gets off and until we get warmed up you really have to stay on it. Today, perfect all day.

And yes the morning washes are slow and of course uses more water and chemicals.

Are all hydraulic slow startup?

 

[Earl Weiss]

Are all hydraulic slow startup?

Tough to make generalizations but oil thins as it heats up and as it thins things will tend t spin faster. A possible solution is as soon as your guy gets there see if he can let the conveyor run for 10 minutes straight to warm things up.

 

[JustaGuy]

I'll let others help with the slow starting speed, but as to switching into Sim Pulse some mornings, I suspect your Maximum Pulse Time is set a bit low for your conveyor speed, and at .34 fps you are right on the edge of it slipping above the threshold and triggering Sim Pulse. Check your average pulse speed while operating at your normal speed of .45 fps and post it here along with your Maximum Pulse Time (Setup - Tunnel Related Parameters - Pulse Switch - Maximum Pulse Time) and I can probably tell if that is what is happening and suggest a better setting.

 

[Rmax]

Thanks. I'll check that today.

 

[Rmax]

max pulse time is set at 10.0 I am not sure what you mean by average pulse speed when operating at .45.

It is the pulse switch that is giving me that reading. Do you mean I should check to see if it is accurate?

Thanks

 

[JustaGuy]

If you are on TW 4 or later, the average pulse time (underlined in red) is shown on the Operations screen in the Inputs window on the upper-right corner - you have to click the button to switch from Enter Switch and Tire Switch to Pulse Switch (inside the red circle):




This is also a great screen to see if the pulse is regular - if you see gaps or the space between pulses isn't even, then something int he pulse system isn't working right. By default, it shows the past 30 seconds of pulses, but can show 60 seconds if you click the "60s" to the left of the red circle. Another thing to not is if it shows any lost pulses.

 

[Rmax]

Thanks for the info. I'll review this today.

 

[Rmax]

Here are 2 readings. One at startup and one warmed up. It has been working OK the past 2 days. has not gone into simulated pulse on it's own. Any insight appreciated. Thanks

 

[JustaGuy]

Those look pretty good, and the average pulse times are where they should be. You'd have to miss more than 5 pulses in a row to trigger simulated pulse with your current settings. I do notice you've recorded 99 lost pulses, so TW has seen issues with the pulse in the past.

First thing I'd do is to reset the lost pulse counter to see if you are seeing any lost pulses throughout the day. To do that, on the Operations screen below the Input window, click on Advanced Troubleshooting, then Reset Lost Pulses, then Reset Lost Pulses again on the Confirm dialog. Check that number periodically during the day and if the pulse is intermittent the number will start increasing. (Note that if the pulse stops working long enough to go into Simulated Pulse, it does not record any Lost Pulses - it has to see a gap in the pulses and see the pulses resume to record lost pulses.)

Other than a failing pulse switch, one of the main causes of missed pulses is a jammed conveyor. Do you have roller jams or other issues that jam the conveyor at times?

 

[Rmax]

Thanks for the input JustaGuy. I'll get that cleared.

We do have jams when people forget to put their vehicle in neutral usually that is a brief delay. But we will monitor to see if there is a correlation of those incidences and simulated pulse.

 

[Earl Weiss]

Thanks for the input JustaGuy. I'll get that cleared.

We do have jams when people forget to put their vehicle in neutral usually that is a brief delay. But we will monitor to see if there is a correlation of those incidences and simulated pulse.

My conveyor torque settings have the roller pass under the tire if the car is not in neutral.

 

[Rmax]

Hi Earl;

Mine will too, sometimes. W do send 2 rollers in case that happens. But it seems if I have 2 or 3 in the tunnel and the prepped car or more normally in my area, a bigger SUV or truck is in park it trips the E stop. Getting more rare since the preppers know to pay close attention to that.

 

[Rmax]

What is considered acceptable for lost pulses? We get at least 99 per day.

Then we get a warning of intermittent pulse come up and sometimes that screws up a wash. Everything starts late. The car is going faster than the pulse switch is telling the equipment to start.

And sometimes it automatically throws it into simulated pulse.

Odd that some days are worse than others. No real pattern.

Thanks for any advise.

 

[Earl Weiss]

From your earlier post. "We have a pulse sensor on the drive sprocket watching the 4 bolts. " Somewhere I think I recall there was something about DRB and minimum time between Pulses. Do you know how many feet per pulse and if it is less than the minimum? There can be several causes aside from violating minimum time. 1. Sensor dirty and missing pulses. 2. Bad Connection to DRB. 3, Bad Sensor. Found out a while back just because light goes on the sensor when target is sensed doesn't mean the pulse is sent to the DRB. 4. Conveyor stalling for whatever reason. Torques should be high enough for roller to pass under a car with foot on the brake / not in neutral.

 

[Rmax]

Where would I find the feet per pulse to see if that is within spec?
So I have employees if someone stays in park they push the e stop until they get it into neutral. Will that effect it?

I have the conveyor set to 900lbs which is what Belanger calls for. Can I get by upping that a bit because at times a vehicle in park will trip the e stop. Or is that an e stop adjustment?

So many questions! Thanks

 

[Earl Weiss]

Pushing E Stop should not effect it. Don't recall where in DRB feet / pulse is located. I don't measure lbs for by pass . I just set it so roller can pass under the vehicle. Are familiar with the Facebook Talk car wash group? There is a subgroup Talk DRB and lots of knowledge there.

 

[JAGraff]

I would recommend contacting the DRB Knowledge Center. Please contact me if you don't get the answer you need. - Julie Graff, DRB Digital Manager