Slow HP soap getting to the SS bay

[Rudy]

We've been pulling our hair out.

My furthest SS bay from the Eq room....takes a LONG time to produce soapy water when High Pressure Soap is selected. In troubleshooting, here's what we seem to observe.

The initial startup will require about 40 seconds to see any soap come out of the HP wand. If HP rinse is selected, the line clears in about 7-8 seconds...which is normal. If HP soap is RE-selected....soap comes out in about 7-8 seconds.

My stands are plumbed with gravity fed Hot Water, gravity fed Soap and Polish. Cold rinse is supplied through a "rinse" solenoid and a (3/8??) poly tube.

The polish cycle on this bay has also been suspect. It's hard to be as precise in troubleshooting because the polish doesn't foam up as much.

What could be going on?

We tested using a HOT water rinse...suspecting that (perhaps) the higher pressure cold water was applying back pressure. The flowmeters for the soap and polish are the same regardless if hot or cold water is used. Flow of chemicals (either polish or soap) can be observed to start immediately....so i know that the solenoids are indeed opening.

Could (somehow) the soap lines be back feeding...and essentially diluting the initial pull of soap into the pump?

Help!

 

[JGinther]

you could put some colored foaming product in the soap mix tank to tint the color of the soap, then see if your cold water rinse is shoving the soap backward (by watching to see if the tinted color goes clear).

 

[Rudy]

The tank levels all appear to remain constant.

Our soap has an orange tint already...but a slight backflow would be barely noticeable as it dilutes the tank. Perhaps it could shove enough backwards to jam water into the soap lines...but not enough to notice in the tank???

 

[JGinther]

You wouldn't probably notice in the main tank because it only happens during hp rinse. Yes, the water in the soap lines is what i was getting at with the cheap and easy colored soap test. You don't have any red foam brush or similar to dump in the mix tank?

 

[chaz]

Are you using hydrominders? May just need to clean the injectors and any inline filter. I just did that and my soaps improved in all bays. So perhaps all your bays have an issue....just more noticeable in further bay?

 

[MEP001]

Never mind, misread post.

 

[JGinther]

Is the water tank level higher elevation than the soap tank level?

 

[2Biz]

I think you'll find JGinther is on the right track. You probably have a soap solenoid not seating correctly allowing heated water to flow backwards towards the soap tank. This happens very gradual, usually over night and you'll see it first wash of the day.

I've had it happen twice, both times there was a piece of debris stuck in the seat of a soap solenoid. It only takes a few inches of water level difference between the soap tank and hot water tank to let water syphon, seeking level. I have a 1/2" pvc soap and wax manifold the full length of the pumpstand. So it was hard to see the diluted soap inside the pipe. Now I have clear LLDPE Tubing from the solenoids to the flow meters. Then clear LLDPE tubing from the flow meter to a tee in the water supply line to the pump. If water is backflowing through soap or wax solenoids, I can see the problem immediately.

 

[Ontario Car Wash]

on the soap and rinse tank

I have a 3 compartment (small soap, small wax , and rinse water) were should the levels be
should one have a higher level?????

 

[JGinther]

No, its fine the way it is. When there are different elevations and a solenoid goes bad, you will either flow chemical to the rinse tank, or vice-versa.

 

[Ontario Car Wash]

Kinda dumb but check your filter screen
i kinda had same problem a week or so ago on my furthest bay and i couldnt figure out why all the rest were fine
so i added surfactant to for more foam
then changed the soap the other day figure i might as well clean up hydro and tip look down in tank and the screen was pretty much covered i wonder i got any soap to any bay. Just a thought something dumb that i overlooked when it should be the first thing i looked at

 

[Rudy]

Fixed! 2Biz you were right on.

We have flow meters attached to the soap (and Polish) supply lines. I noticed first thing in the morning...that the soap line was clear coming out of the flowmeter.

I washed down the bay....purging the soap into the system....and the supply line was yellow.

After doing chores on a rainy day for 2 hours....I noticed that the line was again CLEAR. Hmmmm.

Indeed, the seat on the brass solenoid was in bad shape. I replaced the soap solenoid....and all is perfect.

Perhaps I should use a stainless solenoid instead of brass???

 

[Randy]

Fixed! Perhaps I should use a stainless solenoid instead of brass???

I learned many years ago to only use solenoid valves with a stainless steel seat, prevents a lot of problems.

 

[2Biz]

Randy is 100% correct. He told me about 1/8" SS Kip solenoids years ago and I've never had one fail. I have had debris keeping one from seating causing backflow, but that isn't the solenoids fault. Other than that, the SS kips are great little solenoids and the price is right. Less than $30 Bucks!!