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Major life decision

Ben

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Hey guys, so here is the basic backstory , we’ve (my bro and I) ground out the American dream in Realestate since 2008. We are now exiting with the proverbial “millions” . But as we all know as investors the “millions” turn into pennies if nothing invested.... so we are once again looking around at places to place the money so it continues to work, we feel real estate is at the top and we don’t like how it looks at the moment, we have been circling express washes for years, afraid of the time commitment and in love with the cashflow.
Now we can buy about 5-10 of them.

but here is literally the million dollar question:

will our lives be hell chasing around wash issues 7 days a week? or with managment and regional managment will it be as passive or more so compared to owning apartment communities in different cities across the us that we owned before cashing out?

any owners who have owned apartment communities AND have owned express washes can talk to what we should expect are the differences of time commitment across both portfolio types ?

we are seeking cashflow on our exit as net worth is worthless as far as income goes. Thanks guys
 

OurTown

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It sounds like you keep asking very similar questions in your other posts. You said you were buying 2-3 and now 5-10? That is a lot of washes to purchase for a noob. If you are serious then immerse yourself in everything express exterior and car washes in general. Go in person to look at some that are available on the market and talk to everyone. Just keep in mind that there are some snakes in this industry so be forewarned. After a while you might figure out who is bull crapping you. Express exterior washes are very different than than the apartment industry as far as risk. Park your money for a bit while you get some knowledge of the industry. Then buy one and see how it goes.
 

Ben

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1031 allows no parking. Would love too . With high leverage it can be 5-10 low leverage around 3-5
 

Ben

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Anyone can compare portfolio of express washes with regional manager vs same thing with apartments ?
 

swampdonkey

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Express market appears to be overbuilt,like the ss and iba market in the past. As your an investor,buy one and find out for yourself. As the saying goes `stay in your own lane`.
 

I.B. Washincars

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My background is in the SS and IBA segment, so this is just my opinion, take it for what you pay for it. So many express washes are being built, that in my opinion it just borders on insanity. I feel that within the next 5-10 years we will see that many are failing because what everyone sees as a panacea now, will bite them in the ass because they are being severely overbuilt and put in questionable markets. I just feel it will come crashing down sooner, rather than later. I wouldn't want to risk investing in one express, much less multiples. I've jokingly said that Dollar General should get in the express wash business, since they seem to be in a race to see who can build the most locations in the shortest amount of time.
 

washnshine

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afraid of the time commitment and in love with the cashflow.
It does not matter if you have 1 wash or 20, you cannot expect to be “in love” with your cash flow unless you put in the time.

It’s funny how the car wash industry gets that reputation. How many times do we get someone on the forum who wants to buy a self serve and collect the quarters on Saturday.

I understand owning 10 express exteriors does not mean that you are the only one, and have 10 tunnels that you are personally responsible for replacing the pumps, performing preventative maintenance, personally managing employees and schedules, but it is very far from a “set it and forget it” scenario.

You might want to connect with someone operating 10+ successful sites and see what it entails.
 

Ben

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Def looking for that owner that has a portfolio of them for a chat about life with them. I know what life is with hundreds of rental housing units.


QUOTE="washnshine, post: 151989, member: 5006"]
It does not matter if you have 1 wash or 20, you cannot expect to be “in love” with your cash flow unless you put in the time.

It’s funny how the car wash industry gets that reputation. How many times do we get someone on the forum who wants to buy a self serve and collect the quarters on Saturday.

I understand owning 10 express exteriors does not mean that you are the only one, and have 10 tunnels that you are personally responsible for replacing the pumps, performing preventative maintenance, personally managing employees and schedules, but it is very far from a “set it and forget it” scenario.

You might want to connect with someone operating 10+ successful sites and see what it entails.
[/QUOTE]
 

Waxman

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I think you've gotten some really good advice here. I'm kind of surprised at the lack of due diligence you seem to be performing with such a big potential investment.

I think the car wash business is pretty hands-on. I can see the type of management that it takes to be successful being very expensive and hard to find. I own apartments and a car wash and the apartments are by far a lot easier. I'm at my wash six days a week, fixing things cleaning and managing the employees at the detail shop. I rarely have to go to my apartment building. Granted it's only eight units and not a community, but I would think that managing a community of apartments can be done with a lot less effort than multiple Xpress carwashes.

I think if you rush into buying multiple carwashes because you want to do a tax deferred $ exchange you could make a big mistake.
 

Ben

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we are doing hard core due diligence.... the questions are ones demographics, car counts, expenses, area density, equity, debt, roi, coc, multiple etc etc can’t answer: what is life with a portfolio lie vs life with 400 units of apartments like.

thx for the info gents !




I think you've gotten some really good advice here. I'm kind of surprised at the lack of due diligence you seem to be performing with such a big potential investment.

I think the car wash business is pretty hands-on. I can see the type of management that it takes to be successful being very expensive and hard to find. I own apartments and a car wash and the apartments are by far a lot easier. I'm at my wash six days a week, fixing things cleaning and managing the employees at the detail shop. I rarely have to go to my apartment building. Granted it's only eight units and not a community, but I would think that managing a community of apartments can be done with a lot less effort than multiple Xpress carwashes.

I think if you rush into buying multiple carwashes because you want to do a tax deferred $ exchange you could make a big mistake.
 

washnshine

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I’m not sure where you are located, but I am in NY state. And while I do not have this many washes, I know a few “down to earth” and really good guys who do. They are Tom Hoffman - Hoffman Car Wash and the Daniele brothers - Royal Car Wash.



I’m sure you can find other guys in other areas depending where your are, but this is who I know and would talk to if I was in your situation.

They don’t sell anything and are simply owners who know how to get it done in my neck of the woods. I’m sure both would be glad to grant you a little phone time.
 

Ben

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Maybe a smarter request, who is a regional portfolio manager on here I can call and talk too? Happy to pay you for your time if you are overseeing 3-6 express car washes as a regional manager. We are doing tons and tons .... months actually of asset underwriting , but I need some OPS underwriting too.
 

Ben

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Awesome, exactly what i’m looking for.


I am not anywhere near that market.

I won’t be a comppetitor to them at all.

next steps?





QUOTE="washnshine, post: 151995, member: 5006"]
I’m not sure where you are located, but I am in NY state. And while I do not have this many washes, I know a few “down to earth” and really good guys who do. They are Tom Hoffman - Hoffman Car Wash and the Daniele brothers - Royal Car Wash.



I’m sure you can find other guys in other areas depending where your are, but this is who I know and would talk to if I was in your situation.

They don’t sell anything and are simply owners who know how to get it done in my neck of the woods. I’m sure both would be glad to grant you a little phone time.
[/QUOTE]
 

JGinther

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It sounds like you want what you are getting out of...? If you want what you had, a pile of car washes for sure isn't it. If you are trying to avoid tax, is now the time to avoid it?
 

Ben

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It sounds like you want what you are getting out of...? If you want what you had, a pile of car washes for sure isn't it. If you are trying to avoid tax, is now the time to avoid it?
Can’t get back into real estate , way over priced, no cashflow left at all. So trying to find another industry where cashflow still exists . Washes it does. And debt is low cost, spread to be had still.

but if ownership on the day to day with a regional manager is total focus and dedication, this won’t leave a lot of motivation ... will have to find another way.
So in a nutshell we like the industry, the returns , the debt landscape, we just don’t know how the lifestyle will be on oversight and ownership. They will all be in same city FYI.
 

tdlconceptsllc

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Can’t get back into real estate , way over priced, no cashflow left at all. So trying to find another industry where cashflow still exists . Washes it does. And debt is low cost, spread to be had still.

but if ownership on the day to day with a regional manager is total focus and dedication, this won’t leave a lot of motivation ... will have to find another way.
So in a nutshell we like the industry, the returns , the debt landscape, we just don’t know how the lifestyle will be on oversight and ownership. They will all be in same city FYI.

Ben I would honestly look at other investments than express washes. Remember during a recession people will not wash there cars (which I have person seen & remember) they will rent appartments.
 

Car_Wash_Guy

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Ben I would honestly look at other investments than express washes. Remember during a recession people will not wash there cars (which I have person seen & remember) they will rent appartments.

The only problem with that argument is as we've seen during COVID, the .gov can come in and tell the property owner he has no right to initiate a eviction due to non payment of the rent.

I own MF as well as commercial and office. I've owned a few businesses in my time. The car wash is a fun business to own and operate.
 

Ben

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Ben I would honestly look at other investments than express washes. Remember during a recession people will not wash there cars (which I have person seen & remember) they will rent appartments.
They actually quit renting as well and move in with others instead. Currently major vacancy issues across the country as this happens. Show me data proving they quit washing cars please. I have not seen any yet .
 

Ben

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You need to look at the history of car washes. In around 2008-2010 or so it was ugly.
Absolutely need to see that historical data . Where is it and for express correct ?
 
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