What's new

Low Pressure Tubing Size.

Twodose

Member
Joined
Sep 10, 2007
Messages
481
Reaction score
13
Points
18
Location
NE Pennsylvania
What would be the best size tubing for Low Pressure foam brush, pre-soak, tire cleaner?

I am going to use 3/8 poly tubing for all on the liquid side, was wondering if it is necessary to use 3/8 for the air side though. :D
 

Randy

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 5, 2007
Messages
3,786
Reaction score
341
Points
83
I?ve always used 3/8? O.D tubing for everything. I guess you could use ?? O.D Tubing, I've always had a lot of 3/8" O.D tubing.
 

MEP001

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 30, 2007
Messages
12,457
Reaction score
747
Points
113
Location
Texas
I use 1/4" tire cleaner and foam brush - those don't need the volume of 3/8". Presoak and spot-free do. It wouldn't hurt to use all 3/8", but it definitely isn't necessary and it costs a lot more.
 

Twodose

Member
Joined
Sep 10, 2007
Messages
481
Reaction score
13
Points
18
Location
NE Pennsylvania
Is this in a Self-Serve?

How many bays?

I am curious because I am doing a major re-model on the Exterior of the wash and decided to redo the LP Foam Brush and Tire Cleaner solenoids, all the HP hose and LP hose in all the bays.

The original installation had 3/8? Rubber tubing from solenoids to the bays on the air & liquid on the TC and Liquid on the FB, ?? on the FB air.

The pre-soak had ?? both liquid and air, it never worked right, it always sputters in one bay or another, it came from D/H plumbed with ?? fittings.

I would think like you say ?? for both air and liquid on the FB.

On the Tire Cleaner I would think 3/8? for the Liquid & Air, but I also think you may be able to do ?? on the Air.

On the PS definitely 3/8 for both air and liquid.

On another Wash I changed the ? to 3/8? on everything but the FB. It resolved the sputter issue with the LP wax and PS. It puts out more liquid, with the increased volume the air had to be crancked higher to get it to foam right.

I am not getting as much feedback as to what size tubing is being used by others in the business.

Another concern is with bigger tubing in a 7 bay wash with air driven LP pumps and larger od on the air may be pushing the compressor a little on the busy days.
 

MEP001

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 30, 2007
Messages
12,457
Reaction score
747
Points
113
Location
Texas
The tubing doesn't make as much difference with sputtering in the bays as the adjustments do. Are there individual needle valves for each bay/each function/air and liquid?
 

Twodose

Member
Joined
Sep 10, 2007
Messages
481
Reaction score
13
Points
18
Location
NE Pennsylvania
No. None of the LP units I have from D/H have metering.

When using metered solenoids is it best to have it on both air & liquid or just one or the other?
 
Last edited:

MEP001

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 30, 2007
Messages
12,457
Reaction score
747
Points
113
Location
Texas
Definitely both, since line restriction will always cause a different flow rate in the farther bays.
 

Bubbles Galore

Active member
Joined
Apr 11, 2008
Messages
2,115
Reaction score
0
Points
36
Location
Michigan
I never really thought about needing to use a larger diameter tubing for my presoak. All of my LP functions are 1/4". What should I be looking for that would dictate me using a larger diameter tubing?
 

MEP001

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 30, 2007
Messages
12,457
Reaction score
747
Points
113
Location
Texas
Twodose said:
What size air line do you use on the Presoak?
I use the same air line for both tire cleaner and presoak, 1/4". They're just tee'd together in the room near the solenoids. Unless you're running a very different pressure on the two functions, you don't need separate lines.

Bubbles Galore said:
What should I be looking for that would dictate me using a larger diameter tubing?
I like to send as much liquid to the bay as possible, and agitate it with only a tiny bit of air to make some foam and a little noise. I'll watch video from yesterday and see the percentage of customers that used presoak, but it's usually a lot, I'd say at least a third. They really like it and know they're getting something for their money (It's blue and scented and cleans really well) and it costs about $50 a month in chemical. I've been to many washes where the presoak is too dry or just comes out at too low a volume - customers will get impatient trying to cover their car and will switch to high pressure soap before they've covered half the car with presoak.
 

Twodose

Member
Joined
Sep 10, 2007
Messages
481
Reaction score
13
Points
18
Location
NE Pennsylvania
I use the same air line for both tire cleaner and presoak, 1/4".I've been to many washes where the presoak is too dry or just comes out at too low a volume - customers will get impatient trying to cover their car and will switch to high pressure soap before they've covered half the car with presoak.
This is the problem I have, they get frustrated and switch

So your setup is:

FB 1/4 Air 1/4 Liquid.

TC 1/4 Air 1/4 Liquid

PS 1/4 Air 3/8 Liquid.

Why don't you think you need the same volume for the TC as the PS?

Thanks for the input, I appreciate it.:D
 

MEP001

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 30, 2007
Messages
12,457
Reaction score
747
Points
113
Location
Texas
I keep the tire cleaner liquid throttled way back and add more air than with the presoak. No needle valves on the presoak liquid and 3/8" OD tubing gets more product to the bay for faster coverage, but tire cleaner needs to be strong to work. I'm running it almost three times stronger (the equivalent of 24:1, where the recommended is 64:1) and with only a small amount of liquid mixed with air customers can still cover all their wheels and tires thoroughly in about a minute. If I tried to run that strength and ran as much liquid flow as the presoak we'd probably go through $500 of tire cleaner in a month. As it is, it's about $75.
 

Twodose

Member
Joined
Sep 10, 2007
Messages
481
Reaction score
13
Points
18
Location
NE Pennsylvania
The tubing doesn't make as much difference with sputtering in the bays as the adjustments do. Are there individual needle valves for each bay/each function/air and liquid?
You said this.

Definitely both, since line restriction will always cause a different flow rate in the farther bays.
Then you said this.

I keep the tire cleaner liquid throttled way back and add more air than with the presoak. No needle valves on the presoak liquid and 3/8" OD tubing gets more product to the bay for faster coverage,
Then this.


PS Liquid side is 3/8? .You have no metering on the PS liquid side.

You use the same ?? air line for both PS and TC, evidently you are metering the air lines on both since you don?t have metering on the PS Liquid Side.

You use a higher concentration at a lower volume for the TC liquid side, your metering this.

So basically you have only 3/8 tubing on the PS Liquid side, right?

Everything else is ?? tubing except the SF which uses no air so it wouldn?t matter anyway.

When you give an answer, it is sometime intricately combined and difficult to analyze LOL :D , but you have given enough information that I can comfortably proceed with the task knowing it is done right the first time.

Thank You.
 

MEP001

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 30, 2007
Messages
12,457
Reaction score
747
Points
113
Location
Texas
Sorry for that...it's clearer in my head.

The main problem with not having needle valves is that you won't be able to get all the bays to work the same. Sputtering may not necessarily be a problem caused by a lack of valves if all the bays sputter. It could be weak chemicals, too much air or not enough liquid.

I've found that with 3/8" tubing on the presoak, there's no need for needle valves on the liquid side. I have no trouble getting a wet, slightly foamy product to the bays with just the slightest bit of air, and for that the needle valves are necessary.

You can have two separate air solenoids for presoak and tire cleaner and still use the same tubing to the bay by teeing them together in the room. I use a cross at the boom to bring the presoak, tire cleaner and common air to the same check valve, so a separate air line would be a waste. Since the air needle valves are open so little on both, I see no need for bigger air line tubing.

Yes, 3/8" tubing only on presoak and spot-free (Actually two bays have 3/8" tubing for the triple foam since I wasn't getting enough liquid to them with the 1/4" and 100' runs). Our spot-free is medium pressure, 450 PSI, and 3/8" seems to be plenty.
 
Top